Forbidden Donut

You get free admission even though you're not a Marine yet? That's surprising

But as far as your conditioning goes, I'm not sure if you currently attend or not, but your recruiting office should be holding some sort of P.T session for DEP Poolees at least once a week. I currently do that until I ship out, and highly recommend it. We treat it just as boot camp, and it's definitely a great way to ease into it.

But other than that, from what I've heard running should be a huge focus prior to boot camp. I'm sure you know that you need 1.5 miles in 13:50 which is pretty simple. But if your looking at your PFT, possibly start timing yourself on your 3 mile run and shoot for your 18:00.

I say that because I noticed you mentioned your PFT's for crunches. Personally i wouldnt worry about the scoring as much as the practical uses of your conditioning while at boot camp. You're PFT's will matter very little when compared to the amount of work you're going to be doing as a recruit at MCRD P.I. A very good friend of mine is a retired Major and another being a Master Gunny both praise on running for the number one conditioning aspect prior to boot camp.

I know thats not much to answer your question as far as a program, so I thought I'd just throw that out there for food for thought. Got nothing better to do right now..meh

Yes, on the free gym aspect, I don't know if this is all poolees and Marines alike, but it is here. I didn't know about it until my recruiter mentioned it to me.

As far as the poolee functions, yes they hold them every week. I am attending my first one on Thursday at 1800hrs and will attend next week. After that, I have to make sure my schedule is compliant allowing me to attend. I'm looking forward to it.

btw, the IST is 1.5miles in 13:30 or less.

You should look for Cross Fit Gachi. Look it up on intratube.

So...you need a basic back/bi's work out?

This is fairly simple, and will hit your biceps as well as your entire back. I don't recommend doing this more than three times a week.

Pullups - 3 sets of however many you can do. This is simple. If you don't know what these are you should shoot yourself. Try doing wide grip pullups after a week or two. That's exactly what it sounds like -- a pullup with a wider grip than you normally would use. For widegrip your arms should be at 45 degrees.

Lat Pulldowns - 4 sets of 10-12. You know what this machine is. Use a widegrip as well, 45 degree angle.

Cable Rows - 4 sets of 10-12. This is a cable row. Keep your back in an upright position and pull the closegrip handle to your chest. Make sure you hit your chest.

Lower back hyperextensions - 3 sets of 15. This is a Hyperextension. At first, use just your body weight. As you begin to feel as if this is too easy, grab a 10lb rackable weight, cross your arms over it and bring it close to your chest. Keep pressing the weight to your chest. When these get easy, move to 25lb, 35lb, 45lb, etc. If you get to 45lb and find this too easy, increase the amount of reps.

DB Curls - 5 sets of 10-12. This is a Dumbbell Curl. Use alternating hands, and make sure you don't use momentum to help. Before lifting your other hand, make sure the current one (lifting the DB) is all the way back down to 'resting position.'

Preacher Curls - 3 sets of 10-12. This is a preacher curl. Personally, I only use curled bars (as opposed to straight bars) because straight bars hurt my wrists. Use whichever is comfortable for you.

21's. 3 sets. I can't find you a picture of this so I'll describe it myself. Get a straight/curl bar (the same thing you just used for preachers). Stand up straight. Now think of your body in terms of degrees. While you're holding the bar down by your legs in resting position you're at 0 degrees. When you lift your arms so they're parallel to the ground, you're at 90 degrees. As you bring the bar up to your chest you're at 180 degrees. Now here's the exercise: 7 reps from 0-90 degrees, 7 reps from 90-180 degrees, 7 reps from 0-180 degrees. 21 reps all together, which is why they're called 21's. You cannot stop. 21 reps without stopping is considered 1 set.

This workout will take your 'honeymoon' phase of lifting (the first 4-6 months you ever lift) and will capitalize on it. I really recommend to incorporate all muscle groups to progress symmetrically (not only by look, but by strength). This routine will build endurance as well as strength, and if/when it gets too easy, you can always replace it with some more challenging exercises. But this is a solid foundation for a workout.

Goodluck, and if you have any questions let me know.

I've also been working on pullups in pyramid form. In case you don't know what that is, it's like this:

I'll do 5 pullups, then do 10 pushups, do 4 pull ps, then 10 push ups, 3 pullups, 10 pushups, pullups, 10 pushups, 1 pullup, 10 pushups. However, I find it harder to start going back from 1 to 5 again.

Thanks for the small routine. I'll definitely check it out. As far as weight limits go, what should I start with (or is it what I'm comfortable with)? I also read somewhere using lighter weights, doing more reps help more than heavier weights and less reps. Any advice?

Unfortunately, this probably won't meet Gachi's needs. He leaves on Jan 3rd, and doesn't have time for the honeymoon phase and being a Marine DEP he needs to learn to WORK now.

Gachi, you need General Physical Preparedness, and you need it fast. Just doing upperbody lifting and running a few days a week is going to be insufficient to get you physically ready in 8 weeks. You need to be strong, have some stamina, have some cardio-resp endurance, and to be able to generate some power. The author of the GPP post is an amazing athlete and an amazing trainer, there are plenty of people who can write pretty words for the internet, but he is for real. His gym's website is here and his workout log is here (however you don't have time to read 3 years worth of workouts and comments. In the GGP article linked, the first link at the bottom is perhaps the most important, but it outdated, here is the updated link: http://library.crossfit.com/free/pdf/CFJ-trial.pdf

I've trained Marines before, and trained along-side them (and SWAT guys, and Secret Service, and firefighters and regular ole patrolmen). They often commented on how their previous running and lifting didn't meet their needs for their jobs, and how they wished they had learned about how to do proper GPP earlier. The only person I've trained who went to Iraq comes back right after Thanksgiving (inshallah as the fiancee would say), but he reports that he was well prepared physically. When I was training him acing his PFT was the last thing on his mind. Ripping 20 pull-ups and 100 crunches was easy for him, laughably so.

In one way, Mungo is right, you need to get strong, because strength (in the literal and biological sense) is the foundation of GPP. It doesn't matter how well you can run 3miles, if you can't pick up the sandbag without exhausting yourself, and it doesn't matter how many crunches you can do in 2 mins if your legs, back, and shoulders can't safely get you through the ruck march. The things asked of you as a Marine (distance and sprinting under load, carrying, throwing, dragging and aiming with your heartrate at 99%) do not readily benefit from regular gym transference.

Zero hit the nail on the head here:


So...what to do? You have 8 weeks until bootcamp right? I don't want to go spewing workouts/plans/advice and links and then trying to pare it down via the internet. Call me 240-620-935. I am in Mountain Standard Time, will be at home pretty much all day, and have little better to do, since I interview people as a job right now, and its election day. I will post a template and some advice as well, but calling me will be the best option for both of us.

Update on self:

clean 190, deadlift 355, squat 315, pull-up +90

Mostly been working on some gymnastic strength moves, such as the planche, handstand push-ups, front lever and muscle-ups. Squatting 2x a week, with a random day of pulls from the floor. A little GPP peppered in here and there. Eating lots, weighing in at 192 the past 2 mornings, almost all good useful muscle. I can do 8 L-pull-ups in a row now, and maxed my kipping pull-ups at 22 the other day. Any more and my hands complain...loudly. Solidified the single legged squat (pistol) a few weeks ago, and been using it in warm-up. Just spinning my wheels until I get home and the new Australian Football season starts in March. Would like to be strong enough to do some of the advanced gymnastic moves before the holidays, so I can keep working out sans equipment.

Update:


September 08- Muscle Milk/ Superpump 250

I recently started taking black powder and moving my workout to Reps : 8, 4, 4, 8. Added alot more mass while still keeping almost all the tone, It's a 5 day workout with 1 particular muscle a day. Rugby has kept me in great shape but the food, and offseason is making it more and more difficult to keep tone and speed.

So I've come to ask for options on something to go straight into ridiculous tone, I run everyday atleast 3 miles and about 20 40's with 35sec -1 min breaks. I need either a nice cardio workout for my off days (usually fri and sunday) or a new toning plan for everything.



That's pretty impressive

i bet you like penis

Kiwi, 3 miles everyday ontop of 5 lifting days / week? That seems like it could add up on your body.

Why not run every other day during the week, and just keep your lifting schedule the same.

Why keep the tone during the winter? The winter is meant for people to get fat (and for bodybuilders to get bulk). Right now I am around 12% bf gaining as much as I can, then I will start trimming when the summer comes along and do 2 more shows. It is practically impossible to keep all your lean and gain mass at the same time, you have to do the one or the other.


Here is a pic from show this summer around 2%bf (from left to right: 4th place guy, 1st place guy, and me [3rd place]):

your left pec looks smaller than your right, is this just the angle?

Its the pose, you try to make the right one stick out a little more. The way I have my arm makes it flex that pec more.

I eat so many calories so I can still gain mass, just lean mass which is why I can and do run that much. Make no mistake though I absolutely hate running almost all of the time but it's a must as an athlete. The only problem is I'm not body building =/ and I go right from offseason back into Rugby Tourn around feb (way to early IMO). I'm also playing lacrosse in spring with rugby.
So the running is an absolute must, I have to be able to go for the whole 80 minutes of rugby and 60 minutes of lacrosse without loosing steps. That's how I've always gained mass /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":P" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" /> Lean mass. It's exceptionally difficult and not nearly as efficient when you're trying to get bigger. It's just how I lift. I've had the debate with people about it being one then the other.. but ask gns, I think he saw me a few months before this picture I had tone and mass but not much, a few months later alot more mass with alot more tone. I got shredded since being at school but I've got a diffrent approach. One that I'm sure shouldn't be taken by someone that is pursuing legitiment bodybuilding. I just don't wanna lose my speed.

< Fitness, Fitness, Fitness is our coaches favorite, I've never had to run more in my life.. not even when I wrestled

That's why I need a sick cardio plan, I was hoping someone had something. I was almost positive someone gave me something a LONG time ago. The acronym started with an H and it had a crazy workout but i lost it =[

But I'm pretty sure that's a good idea to zero, but i'm scared haha the only reason I haven't ended up dead is because I can run circles around the 6,3 200-250lb guys that crush people


.. cool

So how long before you can smash cars just by being near them?

Also:

About the same time my body decides to well... get taller?...

To answer Andrews question they scale people on a few things (not in any specific order)

1. tone (how cut and shredded the person is)
2. proportions (How close the muscles are being equal proportionally)
3. symmetry (how one side of your body is equal to the other side) -might think this is funny but my left arm is 1/4" bigger than my right
4. bulk (how big you are)

They graded us on each body part with that rubric (I think on a scale from 1-10) Then they add the points up and whoever has the most points wins that judge. I am pretty sure they add each judges point to see who wins over all.

As you can see I'm not as big as the other guys (maybe in certain spots) but I am more toned then both of them. That was the guy on the lefts downfall. We all pretty much had the same proportions (all of our upper bodies looked better than our legs). Finally symmetry we were all pretty much good in that area.

I don't wanna sound like a queer or nothin but you have a really nice ass

lmao

coffee i <3 you for being about da booty

kiwi is Courts brother right?

If so, I'm seriously going to have mental problems down the road after seeing a built lookalike of Court.

and... True Believer, you came to a Lan before right? If so, you looked nothing like that, so you must be shooting steroids. /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":P" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" />

haha ya I came to two before I started lifting. I just got real into it and learned a lot about the sport and practiced what I learned. It's not really hard to get where I am at, it just takes a lot of dedication and a little bit of money for food, and protein and some creatine supplements.

bullshit.. you must need money for steroids. lol

haha

Let me ask... how does one get a six pack? What exercises are best to build a 6 pack or flat stomach with washboard? /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":P" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" />

6 pack is mostly in the diet, just got to get the bf% down.

But, to build muscle there there is a wonderful book called the complete book of abs. That book has an amazing 24 week program in it that would build up those abs.

book only cost $20.

these are a few pics of me from the LanBQs I went to:

I justify my previous statements after reviewing those pictures... You bought steroids.

I apologize in advance for your mental problems that are due to occur haha, but the six pack thing you want isn't really that hard to attain.

Exactly what true said just get the BF down alot, eat right, and run plus obviously if you want them to look good due ab workouts haha.

I agree with the eating well/correctly and necessary cardio to attain a six pack but I don't think that "special" ab exercises are necessary. I'm pretty sure you can do very general ab exercises and still attain a six pack because that's what I've done. I think the biggest factor is how you eat. You NEED to eat a good, balanced diet to attain a six pack. This means lean meats, lots of fiber, healthy fats, and complex carbs.

QFT

also jason, the cardio workout you were thinking of is called HIIT - High Intensity Interval Training. Basically you have two speeds at which you do your cardio, a sprinting speed and a resting speed. You are supposed to something along the lines of 10 seconds sprinting and then 20 seconds of resting.

If you run outside, basically sprint as hard as you can for 10 seconds and the jog for 20. You do this maybe 8 to 12 times and thats your cardio for the day. You can switch up the sprinting and resting/jogging times to look something like 20/40 or 15/45 depending on how much endurance you have.

If you run on a treadmill, you have to do the speed changes manually which kinda sucks. Or there is a workout program on the treadmill called Interval or something that may help you do it.

Tell me who has better abs (I looked for the best of both magazines)

The runner:


or

The Body Builder:


Both are prolly around the same BF%

Obviously working out your abs gives them a better look.

To be honest, and I mean this in the gayest way possible, I think the runner's abs and chest are 10x more attractive than the body builder's. I'll refrain from making any judgment about his lanky limbs though. The runner looks healthy, and the body builder looks like he's actually made of plastic.

you think that guy looks like plastic check out this crazy asshole



http://www.bestabs.com/Default.aspx

True Believer, all I was trying to say was that you DO NOT need to do "Special" ab exercises to make your abs look good. I think that spending $20 on an ab workout book is wasted money because I believe that you can find good enough exercises by looking online or getting help at the gym. I feel as though there are too many ab workouts that have been created just to make people feel good. People seem to think that the ab muscles are different than every other muscle and need to be worked out "specially".

The abdominals respond the same way that every other muscle does. The 3-6 rep range will produce strength, the 8-12 rep range induces hypertrophy, and the 12-20 rep range helps endurance. Just because they are core muscles doesn't mean ab muscles will grow or look better if you do 50 crunches. 50 crunches will only strengthen the ab muscles endurance-wise. We don't do 50 deadlifts in one set to make our lower back grow.

All I was trying to say was that I believe that diet is the most important aspect in achieving a six pack and that a $20 ab book is not necessary.

I'd spend 20$ on a workout plan / book if I had it, however I get a special rugby workout with Weight, conditioning, and recovery in the pool... It's ridiculous and I can't wait to start it in 2 weeks.

I meant to ask what supplements yout ake for bulk, and supplements to trim?

I'm going to assume muscletech to trim? Could definitely be wrong

I need suggestions for a whey protein shake or protein bars to take. Just started lifting 3 days ago and my arms are unbelievably sore. Also, Im unclear how many shakes im suppose to have per day, or per workout day.

Is there any way to reduce/ prevent the soreness besides stretching, rest, etc.

Thanks.

Protein Shake: Optimum Nutrition 100% Whey Gold Standard - Double Rich Chocolate
Best Bang for your buck.

Protein Bar: Supreme Protein
Both Flavors are delicious and are low in net carbs, but they are high in calories and fat (even though it is good fat). They also stick to the roof of your mouth (these can be found at Wawa, Hess, and I believe Sheets as well as all of your GNC, Vitamin Shops)

I would start with 2 shakes a day (1 at wake up and 2nd after workout). But, I would after a while go up in the amount of shakes a day.

Regarding shakes:

The purpose of a shake is to simply allow the digestion of nutrients faster (liquids digest faster than solids). Because of this, a shake is best used before and after a workout.

Currently, one of the more popular brands of whey is Optimum Nutrition 100% Whey, which can be found at many GNC stores or in a local rite aid (where i get mine). If not that, then what you want to look for is "100% Whey" listed on the front of it. The average is roughly 24g protein per scoop. GNC has their own brand of whey which is made by Optimum Nutrition, just a few bucks more expensive, but just as good. Walmart also sells various brands of good whey. (I like chocolate, or strawberry).

If you want to take a shake pre-workout, than you can, but its not a necessity (personally I have a meal 30-45 mins before because I like feeling more full). If you have a shake, it can be within 15 minutes of your workout. You want to get a good mix of carbs and protein in there. Depending on your bodyweight, a rough estimate would be 40-60g carbs, and 20-30g protein.

Post workout is the most important time to have a shake, because it allows your muscles to be replenished much faster by quicker digestion of the nutrients. What you really want in your post workout shake is about 2.5x more carbs than protein (I have 70g carbs, 25g protein)


As a source of carbs, it varies from person to person on whether they prefer simple or complex carbs. I've always enjoyed a mix of both, which I like to recommend. A good mix would be a banana + oats.

Example of a pre-workout shake:

1/2 - 3/4 cup oats
1 Scoop whey
1-2 Cups Milk
--Blend--

Post Workout:

1 Cup Oats
1 Banana
1 Scoop Whey
1-2 Cups Water (Water is must easier for muscles to take in than milk)
--Blend--



Protein bars I would have to recommend Zero Impact Bars, which are sold at GNC or bought online. They're meal replacement bars that use amazing ingredients, and have all 3 areas of nutrients. The fats are all natural, and not bad for you at all (Go with the pumpkin supreme for sure.) Other than that, try to steer clear of bars with lots of sugar and bad fats. High fructose corn syrup and partiall hydrogenated anything = bad.

eeek didnt mean to ramble there

Thats a long debated discussion there. I would say the best times for a shake are the times I posted (wake up, after workout). Whey is quickest digesting and also the most absorb protein. When you wake up you need two things to keep your body in a anabolic stage, protein and carbs. Without these two nutritions your body will stay in a catabolic stage (which is when your body is feeding off of itself meaning your muscle). Keeping your body in an anabolic stage is the most important thing gaining or cutting weight.


Skim milk works just as good, plus it has added protein in it. The reason water is faster than milk is because milk has fat and fat slows the absorption of the protein, but skim milk has no fat in it and it still has its 8g of protein per serving.

To be clear on something: If I eat a shake when I wake up, I should still eat a good breakfast as well, correct?

Thanks for the suggestions.

Depends on the nutrients that are in the shake. If you're one who isnt very hungry in the morning, a shake would do you well since its not as filling. Just make sure that whatever's in it has enough nutrients to satisfy as a meal (plenty of carbs + protein to keep you anabolic, as True Believer mentioned)

Yes, I would. The shake is just to get that protein out of the way. Normally people eat high carb intake in the morning and not enough protein. So I would either eat a lot of egg whites (4g of pure protein per egg white) or simply eat a shake with a bowl of cereal or pancakes or whatever carb you eat in the morning.

Ok, in the morning I usually eat oatmeal or a high fiber cereal and some yogurt... pretty much all carbs.

get some vanilla whey, strawberries, a banana, blueberries, milk, and blend. tastes great!

what's a good shoulder exercise for strength other than presses?

A nice substitute for shoulder presses are arnolds.

I would always try to do different types of shoulder presses. I mix it up with dumbbells, barbell, and standing barbell. I also mix up the way I do them. For barbell sometimes I do them in the front (mostly front delts some mid) sometimes I do them in the back (mostly mid delts some rear).

I was recommended that I should have 1g of protein per lb of body weight a day. Looking through this thread I saw a suggestion of 1.25-1.5g. My weight for my height isnt too bad (190 at 5'8''), im trying to lower my bfi and increase muscle. Should I keep it at 1g or go higher? Also, how many grams of carbs should I try to eat a day?

I tend to stick the the 60/30/10 ratio. 60% protein, 30% carbs, 10% fat. 4 calories per gram of protein and per gram of carbohydrate. 9 calories per gram of fat.

Take your desired calorie intake, do the math, and that should be a good guideline for you.